DeadPoolX wrote: ↑Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:44 pm
Like Rath said, I think some of the language here is a problem, specifically when it comes to terms that are different in science, but outwardly appear the same due to everyday usage.
Theory is a big one.
For example... the people out there who love to claim that "evolution is just a theory" really don't understand the scientific use of the word and often have a very false impression of what evolution is from the start.
Yes, yes, yes! 1,000 times yes. Yes to the "theory" confusion, and definitely 'boo-hiss' to the "it's just a theory!" crowd.
No-one who knows anything about science or the scientific process will make such a blunder.
DeadPoolX wrote: ↑Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:44 pm
MusicallyInspired wrote: ↑Wed Apr 17, 2019 9:18 am
I'm talking about all us laymen that don't (yet) understand all facets of science and how we currently understand what the universe is and how it works.
We have to take their word for it because we haven't devoted our lives to it. We the laymen have to believe on faith that these scientists are right because we haven't done any of the experiments ourselves for the most part.
Everyone does this every single day. It's why there are so many jobs out there. We can't be everything and know everything, so we have to trust that people who have knowledge, skill, and experience in their field are, at minimum, considered competent.
Unfortunately, we live in a time where anyone can be an "expert" in something because they can Google some topics or use Wikipedia. Add in confirmation bias and a distinct inability to tell correlation from causation, and you have a lot of false information spreading faster than ever before thanks to the Internet.
Hmm, I agree - although when I do research, I go much further than Google and/or Wikipedia. To give an example: I'm currently writing a story set in the time of Ramesses II of Egypt (roughly 1,250 BC). Before I even started writing, I read at least three or four different books by different authors on the subject, from all kinds of angles: what people wore and ate, how they travelled, how they worked and what they did, coins of the era, and so on. I also consult maps of the area - some from books, some from wiki, many from other sources. I educate myself on the Nile, of course, and ancient Egypt's neighbours and gods.
Then, and only then, do I put pen to paper (or keyboard to word-processor).
I'm not trying to boast, or prove a point, or anything. I just feel that if I don't immerse myself in my subject, then the story (when it's done) will be poor. Why should I ask anyone to pay me money for my book, if I do a bad job?
Maybe that's a strange way of looking at things, in an age when books like "Twilight" or "Fifty Shades" sell like hotcakes. But at least my work isn't a piss-poor vampire fanfic, or unrealistic erotica.
MusicallyInspired wrote: ↑Thu Apr 18, 2019 12:19 am
I feel like I'm being ganged up on here a little bit for some reason and I'm not sure what that reason is. I basically agree with most of what you're saying. All I'm saying is that I leave a little bit of room and an open mind for a little more just in case. And I admire others who do the same. Surely we can permit people their extra room to have an open mind? And if the worry is all these laymen who don't understand science voting in people who don't understand science who you don't like, well, I'd say
again that's due in part to a failing of the educational system.
And yes, I know what the definition of scientific theory is.
MI, please don't think of our (very slight) changes of opinion as us ganging up on you. We'd never do something like that!
I agree with you that having an open mind is important, especially when you're a scientist. I also agree that there are many things we don't know about the universe, although I must qualify that statement by adding that the number of those things is shrinking.
Some quick examples: Just 200 years ago- 1819 - it was considered proper discipline to whip children if they misbehaved, and to send them to work in dangerous conditions from the age of 6 or 7. To not believe in biblical inerrancy was heretical, and would expose you to ridicule. People died of, or were disfigured by, diseases like measles, mumps, rubella, chickenpox, and rabies.
Flash forward 100 years, to 1919. Children were (generally) better looked after, and no longer sent to work in factories or mines. Evolution has started to make inroads. Einstein's theories began to take hold. MMR, chickenpox, and rabies were treatable and curable. Just 10 years later, Fleming's famous accident meant the discovery of penicillin - a boon for everyone.
Flash forward another 100 years, to our time. Children are pampered, sometimes to a ridiculous degree. Evolution is generally accepted, though not everywhere. Many of Einstein's theories are taught in schools. Some of the above diseases - previously almost eradicated - are making a comeback, thanks to the anti-vaxxers.
We can go to the moon, and to Mars. How long, perhaps, before humans can set foot on Mars? At the moment this is still science fiction, but perhaps it will be fact within our lifetime - or that of our children?
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I also agree that the educational system is flawed in some western countries. I think this is because it tries to be all things for all people - e.g. some public schools (as opposed to private ones) are asked to teach the kids sociology or religion - whereas they shouldn't have to.
Some schools teach the kids things that are totally irrelevant, or things that shouldn't be taught in publicly-funded schools. Religion is a prime example of this, particularly creationism (and its bastard child, Intelligent Design). But that's another rant.
Phew, that was long. I hope I haven't bored you all.
