Paw's King's Quest Retrospective

[MusicallyInspired]

King's Quest also innovated much of the technology and gameplay elements (not to mention the 3rd person graphical adventure genre!) that tons of game developers copied from afterwards. Why? Because it was successful.

And I disagree about the storyline thing. KQ5's story was great. Not as well laid out as KQ6, maybe, but it was still great. Better than the other games, I'd think. But in my opinion, King's Quest was never about story. It focused much more on the puzzles and adventure gameplay.

[Tawmis]

King's Quest also innovated much of the technology and gameplay elements (not to mention the 3rd person graphical adventure genre!) that tons of game developers copied from afterwards. Why? Because it was successful.

And I disagree about the storyline thing. KQ5's story was great. Not as well laid out as KQ6, maybe, but it was still great. Better than the other games, I'd think. But in my opinion, King's Quest was never about story. It focused much more on the puzzles and adventure gameplay.

Well, I think the reason King's Quest isn't always hailed for its story telling is - well, like I said in the previous post - I don't think with King's Quest I or II, she was even trying to make a story. She was just designing and an adventure/puzzle game.

With KQIII, she began telling a story -
The adventure EXPANDS beyond Daventry (where KQI and KQII take place) - and starts in Llewdor, where you control Gwydion (who you later discover is actually Prince Alexander) is being kept by the bastard of a wizard, Manannan. You escape that, go through several puzzles, and come to save the girl held captured by the Dragon - who is none other than Princess Rosella.

So right there, you can tell Roberta was putting some foresight into the game. (Not only by setting up Rosella, but within KQIII, looking behind the tapestry in Manannan's house may bring up a plug for King's Quest IV's development - which shows she was clearly planning ahead).

KQIV then switches the main character to Rosella. And this time, once again, she expands beyond the land by exploring the land of Tamir, where she learns about a magical fruit that can heal her father. The main characters she encounters are Genesta, Lolotte and Edgar - and while none of them are ground breaking - they're all typical characters you'd find in a fantasy setting. And considering, I always considered King's Quest the "family game" of the Sierra family - it seemed perfectly fitting.

KQ5 we switch back to Daventry, and really get to see King Graham develop (for the first time). I thought the characters they interacted with, were interesting and engaging (except for Cedric, who truly, my only qualm was his voice - I didn't mind Cedric otherwise). I even thought all the very minor characters, for being what they were, were clearly developed. And the fact that they tied it into KQIII, I thought made it more interesting; because it brings the story together (and shows some consistency) and gave the main villain a clear purpose.

KQ6, I probably don't even need to go into.

KQ7, I thought was an interactive Disney movie, pretty much; with fun, and interesting characters (probably for a younger age; but again, I have always considered King's Quest the family game of the company, so once again, this was fitting).

Which is one of the main reasons, I dislike MoE so much. It went against everything that had previously been developed throughout the KQ series; and it was dark, RPG, slasher, and turned away from being the family game of the series. It was a horrible follow up, considering the previous games. MoE felt like a break away from QFG, but wanting to be darker, to capture the "darker games" out there - but stamped with Sierra's most recognized property - King's Quest.

[jujigatame]

The problem is, which of the KQ series were great games overall? Even if we leave aside KQ1 and KQ2 and games that simply came too early to be anything but primitive, all of the other games in the series (perhaps barring KQ6) had massive flaws and fell far short of greatness:

KQ3 - The first of the series with a decent story, but this is just a horrifically punishing game. Time limits, instant deaths all over the damn place, the whole spell system. Incredibly user unfriendly.

KQ4 - A nice step forward, but still rife with instant deaths and dead-ends. The storyline was nothing as special as advertised. Sort of trite and forgettable.

KQ5 - Another total throwaway boilerplate storyline, and Williams STILL includes utterly brutal dead ends in the gameplay.

KQ6 - No complaints, great game, probably due to Jensen.

KQ7 - Basically a corny Disney knockoff, there is nothing special or significant about this game.

KQ8 - An action/adventure that satisfies neither action gamers or adventure gamers.

So I would argue, aside from KQ6, everything Roberta Williams did was thoroughly forgettable in the long run.

[envisge0ne]

My favorite games to this day are the KQ games. I replay 1-6 all the time. I've played many other adventure games, but there is something about KQ that I keep going back to. Regardless of a weak storyline (which I think KQ3-KQ7 had good story lines). Dead ends, of course, can be frustrating, but they only made me want to try harder. I didn't get frustrated and give up. I thought the puzzles were very clever (cept for the cheese in KQ5 - That was just stupid). I guess it's all personal opinions based on what you grew up with. But I love them and easily understand why they were the most popular, best selling games of the 80's.

[Tawmis]

I think me and envisge0ne are of the same mold.

KQ3 - The first of the series with a decent story, but this is just a horrifically punishing game. Time limits, instant deaths all over the damn place, the whole spell system. Incredibly user unfriendly.

Was KQ3 difficult? Oh Hades yes. To this date - there is no character I hate MORE than the Wizard, throughout Sierra's entire history. That wizard is the most hated set of pixels my eyes have ever laid eyes on. Perhaps taking into consideration every single game I have ever played.

That said however, this did not stop me from enjoying KQ3 - especially the first time around. (Admittedly, more frustrating to me, these days - because I hate when I forget something). But when I originally played KQ3 (like most Sierra games back in the day), I played it along side with my friend. We would spend HOURS and HOURS, and even DAYS on end, especially when we stayed the night at one another's house on the weekends; just trying to beat whatever Sierra game we had. KQ3 was no exception. When we died, or messed up, or got stuck - we would laugh, restore and see where the Hades we went wrong. Perhaps playing it with said friend gives it an edge to not hate it so much, because I have a lot of good memories from playing... But yes, KQ3 was difficult. Very difficult. But still a fun game. I thought from all the things you see and do, it made the game feel so big. From escaping the wizard, to the pirate ship, to the other lands, then into the clouds, a dragon, rescuing a girl (your sister!), and discovering you're more than some mere servant... To me, it made the whole experience. Yes, it was punishing. Yes it had dead ends. But so many Sierra games did back in the day. Al Lowe was pretty famous for saying in all the LSL manuals, "Save Early, Save Often!"

KQ4 - A nice step forward, but still rife with instant deaths and dead-ends. The storyline was nothing as special as advertised. Sort of trite and forgettable.

Here's where we disagree (and most disagree with me). KQ4 was one of my favorites of the entire series. The game felt so huge and so alive. Night and day cycle. Characters (Cherub, Unicorn, dude with the lute whose name I forgot) who would come and go from the screen (and not always be a static, existing character on that given screen). KQ4 felt alive to me, because things moved about. There was also so much to see, it felt like. And I actually really liked the storyline (and when I first beat KQ4, I remember writing a fanfic that deal with Rosella and Edgar getting together). I also enjoyed KQ4, because we finally see a female character as the main role. It was daring. It was different. And like most of Sierra back then, it was ahead of its time.

KQ5 - Another total throwaway boilerplate storyline, and Williams STILL includes utterly brutal dead ends in the gameplay.

I liked the storyline, because it tied in KQ3. It showed that these games WERE truly connected. And you keep mentioning "brutal dead ends" - what Sierra game did not have brutal dead ends? Or instant deaths? Leisure Suit Larry had them (both brutal dead ends, and instant deaths). Space Quest had them both. Police Quest had them both. Most of the classic games at that time from Sierra had them.

KQ6 - No complaints, great game, probably due to Jensen.

Agreed, had great characters; but it too had its dead ends (but I don't think it had instant deaths, except for a few spots).

KQ7 - Basically a corny Disney knockoff, there is nothing special or significant about this game.

I like that the one KQ game that has absolutely no way to get stuck (dead end), or even deaths (that I can remember) - you complain about. I think the Disney like animation was a step forward. They had, essentially, created an interactive cartoon.

So I would argue, aside from KQ6, everything Roberta Williams did was thoroughly forgettable in the long run.

We shall agree to disagree.

[Zapher]

i loved paw's retrospective on kings quest. i believe he was talking about doing one for Quest for Glory next (i really hope he does as QFG4 is my favorite game of all time)

[Datadog]

He and his friend Roses plan on doing play-throughs for all the QFG games. They've only done QFG1 so far, though.

I've been watching his KQ2+ play-through. It's a little more weird to watch because you can hear him talking to people who are typing in a chat window while they watch him play. His KQ5 play-through is still hilarious, though.

His next video will cover the remakes and fan-games.

[MusicallyInspired]

Ah nice!

[Zapher]

He and his friend Roses plan on doing play-throughs for all the QFG games. They've only done QFG1 so far, though.

I've been watching his KQ2+ play-through. It's a little more weird to watch because you can hear him talking to people who are typing in a chat window while they watch him play. His KQ5 play-through is still hilarious, though.

His next video will cover the remakes and fan-games.

he also did a good one for Conquest of The Longbow

also if you like his stuff check out Hercrabbieness she did a good lets play of The Colonels Bequest and Dagger of Amon Ra

[Datadog]

I've gone through her channel too. Hers are fun to watch because she experiments with the games, always trying to get herself killed or discover a new easter egg.

Amayirot Akago also did some good LPs for the SQ series. Then there's Lateblt who has tons of Sierra classic, and PushingUpRoses has a lot of funny mini-episodes. And then there's our Bonny, of course. These LPers really help satisfy my craving for games when I have no time to actually play them.

[DeadPoolX]

I've gone through her channel too. Hers are fun to watch because she experiments with the games, always trying to get herself killed or discover a new easter egg.

LateBlt and HerCrabbiness do a lot of videos together. I get the impression that they're a couple or something, but I could be wrong.

[jujigatame]

I don't think it's totally accurate to say that all the other Sierra series had the same gameplay issues that KQ had. I've played the majority of installments in all the major Sierra series, and KQ was routinely the most brutal, unforgiving, and gamer-punishing. KQ3 is very noteworthy in this regard, but perhaps most noteworthy is KQ5's "save the rat from the cat" puzzle which might be the most evil and unforgivable piece of design I've ever seen in an adventure game.

As for the stories, putting KQ6 aside, I never found them to be anything but trite and forgettable. I always felt QFG was a much better use of a fantasy setting, with more memorable characters and a more original storyline with a more epic feel. Even Roger Wilco's goofy expolits were more compelling to me.

We'll probably just have to agree to disagree on this one.

[Datadog]

LateBlt and HerCrabbiness do a lot of videos together. I get the impression that they're a couple or something, but I could be wrong.

He does a few collabs with other girls too. He's a player.

[Tawmis]

LateBlt and HerCrabbiness do a lot of videos together. I get the impression that they're a couple or something, but I could be wrong.

He does a few collabs with other girls too. He's a player.

Literally, eh?

[MusicallyInspired]

I still don't understand people's misgivings about the cat/rat puzzle. Obviously you're supposed to do something there. If you don't then it should click that you missed something. It's not just some random occurrence. You can't even walk while it's happened. Obviously you're supposed to do something.